John Palmer
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Post by John Palmer on May 12, 2015 19:06:47 GMT -8
Greg, I'm sure your aware, but maybe for others, when you put it back together, pay attention to the direction of the axle, there's "a front, and a rear side" to it. When correctly installed, it will have about 1/8th inch "toe in".
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mobiltec
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Post by mobiltec on May 12, 2015 19:53:34 GMT -8
Greg, I'm sure your aware, but maybe for others, when you put it back together, pay attention to the direction of the axle, there's "a front, and a rear side" to it. When correctly installed, it will have about 1/8th inch "toe in". John do you happen to know if new axles are the same way?
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John Palmer
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Post by John Palmer on May 12, 2015 20:48:55 GMT -8
Greg, I'm sure your aware, but maybe for others, when you put it back together, pay attention to the direction of the axle, there's "a front, and a rear side" to it. When correctly installed, it will have about 1/8th inch "toe in". John do you happen to know if new axles are the same way? Yes, new axles have a "built in", it's actually factory bent, toe in and negative camber. The easiest way to tell on a hollow/tubular axle with brakes, will have the wires coming out on the rear.
It's also very easy to measure the front and rear treads for the 1/8th inch difference. It just needs to be narrower in the front. Just like the front of a car suspension.
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mobiltec
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Post by mobiltec on May 13, 2015 6:09:31 GMT -8
Thanks John. I hate having to do a job twice because I didn't know something.
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RinTin
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Post by RinTin on May 13, 2015 6:48:45 GMT -8
Greg, I'm sure your aware, but maybe for others, when you put it back together, pay attention to the direction of the axle, there's "a front, and a rear side" to it. When correctly installed, it will have about 1/8th inch "toe in". Thanks John, and no, I didn't know that. You had mentioned the toe in on another thread and I wondered how the heck do you adjust for it. I've never seen how axle's are manufactured. Considering that the mounting flanges for the brake assemblies are welded on, I'd be curious to know just how that 1/8" toe in is built in. I beveled the ends of each leaf on my grinder and compared the individual spring leafs from each side and found that some had slightly more arch than their counterpart. I was thinking I might intermix the leafs with all of the ones that have more arc on the street side since that side of the trailer will be heavier. I know that conventionally, parts that wear together should stay together, but question if it's absolutely applicable in this situation.
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John Palmer
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Post by John Palmer on May 13, 2015 9:52:22 GMT -8
Greg, I'm sure your aware, but maybe for others, when you put it back together, pay attention to the direction of the axle, there's "a front, and a rear side" to it. When correctly installed, it will have about 1/8th inch "toe in". Thanks John, and no, I didn't know that. You had mentioned the toe in on another thread and I wondered how the heck do you adjust for it. I've never seen how axle's are manufactured. Considering that the mounting flanges for the brake assemblies are welded on, I'd be curious to know just how that 1/8" toe in is built in. I beveled the ends of each leaf on my grinder and compared the individual spring leafs from each side and found that some had slightly more arch than their counterpart. I was thinking I might intermix the leafs with all of the ones that have more arc on the street side since that side of the trailer will be heavier. I know that conventionally, parts that wear together should stay together, but question if it's absolutely applicable in this situation. They "tweek" the axle after they are welded, or in the old case of when they still made forged the axles. It's just a high tech term for a controlled bending. If you look at a new axle from the rear, it will have a visible "bow up" in the middle, this is called negative camber, when the wheels are closer in at the bottoms, compared to the top. If you viewed the axle from a top view, it would be bent in (to the rear) at the center, making the tires "toe in". A 1/8" toe in at the outer edge of the tires is a very slight bend in the middle of the axle, less than the eye could see. In sixty years of hitting curbs, and road debris, trailer axles do get bent out of alignment, and can cause towing problems, and tire wear.
As long as you clean up the leaves, grind off any sharp edges, I see no problem with interchanging side to side, or individual leaves. You most likely have a local spring shop in any large metro area that can easily re-arch you old springs. I was told by two very old spring shops in my area that the steel used in our old springs is far superior to the trailer springs currently being imported from China. It's not expensive to have original springs rebuilt, re-bushed, re-arched, or any other change made at a good spring shop.
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RinTin
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Post by RinTin on May 18, 2015 11:53:36 GMT -8
It was now time to paint the tongue and rear bumper. I also wanted to paint the wheels, tongue jack and the propane tank mounts the same color. The layout of the propane tanks and battery on the tongue needed to be re-worked and would require new framing cross members. I spent some time trying to sort it out but in the end, decided to wait until the body was back on the frame to insure everything would fit with good clearances. So, I’d be painting color a second time which I felt was fine, as before it was over there would likely be some touch up needed anyway. I would paint all the parts I had and saw no reason not to include the aluminum siding pieces that were the same color as well. I wanted the color to match the original, so I took a piece of the original aluminum into our local auto paint supplier and had them custom mix a single stage urethane automotive paint to match. The wheels were new and only needed to be scuffed with a maroon scotchbrite to be ready for primer. The rest of the steel parts were wire brushed, soaked in a solution of oxalic acid and water to remove the rust, then wiped down with Ospho and were ready for primer. The stains and corrosion on the back side of the aluminum siding were cleaned up first so it wouldn’t have to be done with the new paint on. These areas will be treated with another coating later and I didn’t want to take a chance on the paint having a reaction to whatever coating will eventually be used here. With a hammer and dolly I banged out the dings and dents as best I could, then the old paint was stripped and cleaned up. Cleaning the backside: Typical paint before stripping: During and after stripping: I was assured by my paint supplier that it wasn’t necessary to completely remove all of the original finish and OK to re-coat over what was left behind and well adhered after the stripping process. Next I cleaned the aluminum with the acid based aluminum cleaner/conditioner recommended by my paint supplier. They had told me that sulfuric acid would work just as well at less than half the cost, but I had a weather window to work within and needed to act fast so went with what they had. It is important to thoroughly rinse the aluminum after cleaning so the acid doesn’t continue to eat away at the metal. With the prep work finished it was time for primer. The frame was masked off and all the parts and pieces hung and laid out. I didn’t want to paint the frame from underneath, so I coated the top side with primer first, then flipped the frame over and primed the bottom side.
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RinTin
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Post by RinTin on May 18, 2015 13:08:05 GMT -8
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Post by vikx on May 18, 2015 22:24:23 GMT -8
Thanks Rintin, for posting such great photos along with the info! Lookin Good...
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John Palmer
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Post by John Palmer on May 19, 2015 11:32:52 GMT -8
Looks good.
The metallic colors are not as easy as solid colors to spray. I'm not sure I could get the painted panels all back on the trailer without damage, I'd paint them, or have them painted after installed. I think what your photos show, is that anyone can achieve "professional results", as long as you read the directions, take your time with prep, and talk with your supplier for advice.
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pathfinder3081
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Post by pathfinder3081 on May 19, 2015 12:22:33 GMT -8
That really looks good.. Thanks for sharing..
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RinTin
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Post by RinTin on May 19, 2015 14:49:07 GMT -8
Thanks for the encouragement, lots more to come. This thread is about 6-weeks behind my actual progress. Hopefully it will be current before finishing so you all can help keep me from making any disastrous mistakes.
I am posting in the exact sequence that this build has progressed, doing what seems the next best step and trying not to overreach too far, as in pre-painting the siding panels. We'll see how re-installing them goes. So far so good.
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longroads
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Post by longroads on May 27, 2015 17:10:50 GMT -8
I have read this over a few times and each time I find something new to learn. As others have mentioned, your descriptions and photos have been very clear and understandable. Thank you for taking the time to share!
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RinTin
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Post by RinTin on May 28, 2015 17:48:29 GMT -8
Installing the plywood sub-floor with the axle removed would be much easier, so that’s the way it went. 1-1/8” underlayment plywood was used as it would provide a very solid floor and is close to the original floor thickness. The belly pan and fiberboard were omitted for reasons explained earlier. From my measurements off the original floor I cut the panels to width, but 1/8” narrower. Except for the roof, I hope to re-use the original aluminum skins. The sill plates at the bottom of the walls will be replaced, and things tend to grow as you stack them together, so this 1/8” will provide a little wiggle room when re-fitting the skins. The front leading edge of the plywood was cut at a bevel to match the angle of the front wall that will join to it. Interior paneling will be attached from the outside to this edge at the front and rear, so the angle needs to match up with the walls. Underlayment plywood is tongue and groove. Not knowing how tight it would join, I pre-fit the plywood together then measured and marked the overall length before cutting the rear edge. Since there was room to do so, the joint locations of the plywood were also re-located. Originally there was a joint about 4” behind the rear wheel well cutout. The plywood cantilevers off the main frame at this location without being supported by an outrigger. Having a joint here would be inherently weak, plus it would receive a lot of road spray from the tires which the joint could easily trap, leading to moisture problems. I calculated the plywood layout and moved the joint about 6” forward of the rear wheel well cutout. The underside of the plywood would be coated, but first I wanted to pre-fit it to the frame. The two main frame rails were nowhere near parallel to each other, so a string was stretched down the center of the frame from the coupler to the center of the rear bumper. The center of the plywood was marked, and the front piece laid out with the leading edge matched up to where I had indexed it. I then marked the original front two deck to frame bolt hole locations on the underside of the plywood, pulled it off and drilled the holes. The front piece of plywood was then re-positioned and bolted to the front of the frame. Since the plywood joint locations were changed, except for at the rear edge, I needed to drill new bolt holes through the frame. As each piece of plywood was fitted, bolt holes were drilled far enough through the plywood to score the frame for drilling later. After pre-fitting the plywood, it was pulled up again, the underside was coated with asphalt emulsion and the new bolt holes drilled through the frame. This trailer has two 1-1/2” x 3” wood floor joists running lengthwise between the frame rails. Originally these joists rested on top of the frame angle iron cross ties, unattached to the frame and nailed to the plywood with 10d ring shank nails. After 50 years, the old joists were still in perfect condition. I considered re-using them but it wouldn’t have been worth the effort. New Douglas Fir 2x4’s were purchased, ripped to width, cut to length, then coated with asphalt emulsion and positioned before the final floor installation. Because they had done so well as originally installed, I saw no reason attach the new joists to the frame but I did use #10 x 2-1/2” screws instead of nails to fasten them to the plywood. The plywood was fastened to the frame the same as was originally done, with two galvanized 3/8” carriage bolts in front, and galvanized ¼” carriage bolts for the rest. There are 18 bolts in total. This is all that connects the body to the frame. I considered using larger bolts but this held very well for the first 50 years. I saw no good reason to mess with success here either.
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RinTin
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Post by RinTin on May 28, 2015 17:53:28 GMT -8
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