chametzoo
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Post by chametzoo on Oct 1, 2014 9:01:00 GMT -8
Hi… Temps are starting to dip into the low 40's, and even upper 30's overnight here, so it's time to winterize my trailer. This will be my first attempt at this, so I'd like to check in here and make sure I'm covering all the bases.
Here's my system:
1] 20 gallon plastic fresh water tank.
2] Electric pump.
3] Kitchen sink.
4] Shower.
5] Toilet with black tank.
6] Vaillant on demand hot water heater.
Probably the first thing to do is drain the fresh water tank. Tank drains from a port at the bottom of the side. May have to tilt it a bit to get the last bits out. Both kitchen sink and shower drains are a straight shot out the floor of the trailer. No grey tank, no traps. The cold and hot water loops have drain valves built into the piping at the low points of both. "T's" are built in that drain out through the floor. I have not used the black tank or toilet since I've owned this trailer, but it most likely has a bit of residual water in it since I've kept some water in the bowl.
So drain the fresh water, open the hot and cold low point drains, open the black tank valve and drain. Open all hot and cold fixture valves. My main concern is making sure the Vaillant heater is completely empty. Theoretically, opening the hot loop low point valve would do that, but I think the Vaillant also has its own drain plug, which I'll look for.
What else should I be doing? Is RV antifreeze entirely necessary? I've heard some folks push air through their system to evacuate all water. Is that practical? Are there any precautions I should take with the pump itself, to purge it of all water?
There are many RV winterizing tutorials, but I thought better to ask the vintage experts. Thanks!
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Post by vikx on Oct 1, 2014 21:04:40 GMT -8
I think your plan sounds pretty good. I would be concerned over the Vaillant as well! When you are draining the low points, be sure to open the faucets. That will help drain the pipes.
Air blowing is a good idea with so many fixtures. With a helper, it's easy. After draining, plug the drains. Blow air into the city water connection (no more than 45psi) and open each faucet handle one at a time (hot/cold) until water quits dribbling.
I pump the pump dry, but if it gets REALLY cold in your neck of the woods, I'd use RV antifreeze. Open the intake side and connect a tube to the pump. Put it in a jug of antifreeze and pump thru the faucets. As they drain, the antifreeze will protect any traps.
Also run some antifreeze thru the toilet. The online tutorials should be correct, you have similar systems.
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chametzoo
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Post by chametzoo on Oct 2, 2014 10:19:16 GMT -8
I think your plan sounds pretty good. I would be concerned over the Vaillant as well! When you are draining the low points, be sure to open the faucets. That will help drain the pipes. Air blowing is a good idea with so many fixtures. With a helper, it's easy. After draining, plug the drains. Blow air into the city water connection (no more than 45psi) and open each faucet handle one at a time (hot/cold) until water quits dribbling. I pump the pump dry, but if it gets REALLY cold in your neck of the woods, I'd use RV antifreeze. Open the intake side and connect a tube to the pump. Put it in a jug of antifreeze and pump thru the faucets. As they drain, the antifreeze will protect any traps. Also run some antifreeze thru the toilet. The online tutorials should be correct, you have similar systems. Thanks Vikx! Is there anything I can do for the Vaillant other than drain it as best I can? I suppose if I use RV antifreeze throughout the trailer's plumbing, it will fill up the Vaillant's internal piping too. Should I also leave a little RV antifreeze in the black tank and fresh tank as well? |
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Post by vikx on Oct 2, 2014 21:18:58 GMT -8
I would drain the fresh tank, no antifreeze. It's very hard to flush in the spring. Not worth it.
It's been a couple of years since I had the Vaillant, not sure but isn't there a drain? I believe ours had one in the middle...
Salt or antifreeze in the black tank.
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chametzoo
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Post by chametzoo on Oct 3, 2014 8:25:27 GMT -8
Thanks again… Yes, there is a drain nut in the middle part of the unit where the diaphragm is. I'm going to work on this today and I'll let you know how it goes.
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chametzoo
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Post by chametzoo on Oct 3, 2014 15:53:28 GMT -8
Okey dokey… so I evacuated the the plumbing system today. It went well, but took a while to get all lines clear. Was able to adapt my compressor nozzle to connect directly to the city water inlet which made the whole thing a one person operation. Drained the Vaillant on demand in as many ways as I could find and feel pretty confident, there is no water hiding in there. But not being aware of the internal path of the cold supply within it, I can't be sure that there isn't some niche or pocket of water that the air pressure was not able to force out. So it's probably a good idea to use some RV antifreeze as has been advised here. I'm wondering how many bottles I'll need? It's a 15' cabin [see description of system in original post above]. Sink and shower drains have no traps since they drain to the ground. I'll also need a little for the black tank. Any estimates?
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Post by vikx on Oct 3, 2014 21:04:22 GMT -8
One gallon should do everything. There are tutorials online on how to Winterize a travel trailer; easiest is a kit made to connect to the on demand pump for antifreeze. Also, you can purchase a hand pump kit that fits in the city water inlet.
You only have the lines and faucets, maybe a little in the pump and the Vaillant. I've easily done an entire modern trailer with one gallon of RV antifreeze. That does NOT include filling the 6 gal tank water heater. LOL.
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chametzoo
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Post by chametzoo on Oct 5, 2014 16:39:45 GMT -8
I've completely evacuated the trailer of all water, I am confident. Used the compressor again today for the second time and luckily found and repaired a stuck cold water valve in the shower. I think I'll only be using RV antifreeze in the toilet and some in the black tank. Under these circumstances, is it a good idea to keep fixture valves open… or closed through the cold season? Same for the low point, hot and cold drains? I'll let you all know in the springtime if I was successful with this approach.  |
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Post by vikx on Oct 6, 2014 23:01:31 GMT -8
If you're confident the lines are clear, I would gently close the fixtures. Not TIGHT, just so. Keeps tiny spiders out. Also, if you're able, use plumbers grease on the black tank valve. Never leave that valve open, even in use. The tank is meant to be used closed with chemicals, then flushed. With the valve left open, a little Mt. Vesuvius can form just under the toilet...and dry like cement.
Of course, in the Spring, all must be inspected. I'm sure your efforts will reward; sounds good to me.
Don't forget to keep the battery on a maintainer if you have one. Some of us forget that.
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soup
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Post by soup on Oct 7, 2014 3:31:43 GMT -8
Just keep in mind, antifreeze is only good to a point. This past winter it got so cold here even it froze!
In early spring we would bring units in for prep for being sold. When we took black water tank cap off we found the pipe froze solid with pink antifreeze. We would have to leave them sit overnight before we could de-winterize them.
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chametzoo
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Post by chametzoo on Oct 7, 2014 10:43:49 GMT -8
If you're confident the lines are clear, I would gently close the fixtures. Not TIGHT, just so. Keeps tiny spiders out. Also, if you're able, use plumbers grease on the black tank valve. Never leave that valve open, even in use. The tank is meant to be used closed with chemicals, then flushed. With the valve left open, a little Mt. Vesuvius can form just under the toilet...and dry like cement. Of course, in the Spring, all must be inspected. I'm sure your efforts will reward; sounds good to me. Don't forget to keep the battery on a maintainer if you have one. Some of us forget that. Sure… black tank valve will be closed. What does the plumber's grease do? And speaking of spiders and other insects seeking refuge in the winter: I suppose I should put a couple of corks in my kitchen sink and shower drain lines (they're trapless). |
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Post by vikx on Oct 7, 2014 21:25:46 GMT -8
Plumber's grease is a very benign grease that won't rot rubber or plastic. (today it is usually silicone grease) I like to use it on any sliding apparatus (ie: black valve), faucet gaskets and any place else that might get sticky... The grease will actually cure a dripping faucet. I've even had it work on an old propane tank. Of course! we got rid of it after the propane was gone...
An easy way to plug your drain lines is to insert a hose barb with male hose threads. Then a 50 cent hose cap. Even mousies like those drain lines. Little devils.
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