vociferous
New Member
Posts: 17
Likes: 1
Currently Offline
|
Post by vociferous on May 13, 2024 21:07:50 GMT -8
The sink on my trailer drains to a side outlet (like this one: www.etrailer.com/Plumbing/Valterra/T01-0091VP.html?feed=npn) and a louvered vent above it. The huge 1.5 inch (!) drain pipe that connects to that outlet has cracked. I was looking at this thread (https://vintagetrailertalk.freeforums.net/thread/7075/water-drain-thingy) and liked the idea of the sea dog washdown stainless. So I go to look at things from behind and I see this situation:  And I'm thinking, ok, this shouldn't be too difficult actually, I can just remove this (brass?) waste pipe and figure out what threads I need to connect to one of those seadog vents. Then I look down and see:  And I think, well, that looks like where the sink used to drain to a spot under the trailer. That seems like less trouble than having to hook up a hose to keep things from making a mess on the side of the vehicle. So I go and look underneath and I see:  And I stick my finger through it and there's nothing blocking it at all. It's a straight hole just sitting there. So I'm leaning towards eliminating the vent and drain on the side and just going to what (I assume) was the original solution. But then I'll have to patch the aluminum and that's a lot of work. What would you do? And why? |
|
John Palmer
Senior Member
Hi, From a vintage trailer guy located in Santa Ana, CA. It's good to see lots of activity here.
Posts: 1,706 
Likes: 600
Currently Offline
|
Post by John Palmer on May 14, 2024 7:32:05 GMT -8
No advice takers for this new member?
The question is a little convoluted, but as I understand it you are talking about three different things.
The small hole in the floor was likely from an Ice Box drain hose. It's a perfect rodent entry door, so I would place a metal patch over that hole.
Next you need to remember that water displaces air space. Water cannot flow if you design an air lock into your sewage system. That is why you have the brass pipe above where the drain "T's" into your drain pipe. It's the vent line.
If you do not choose to repair the drain and vent pipes as they were originally configured, then you might consider using an AIR ADMITTANCE VALVE as a vent source. Oatey makes some, they are about $20., and they will prevent the methane sewer fumes from entering your trailer. They are basically a one way check valve. I used one under my kitchen sink, and it's worked fine for the past six years.
What do you plan to do with the original holes in the side of your trailer skin? Seems like it would have been just easier to fix the original plumbing issue instead of re-designing the system?
Hope this helps.
John Palmer
|
|
vociferous
New Member
Posts: 17
Likes: 1
Currently Offline
|
Post by vociferous on May 14, 2024 8:28:10 GMT -8
Thanks for picking up the discussion!
I don't think this is a drain for the icebox because the icebox is still there and it's on the other side of the vehicle and it does indeed drain out the bottom of the trailer through a little hose in almost the same way as whatever once used the hole here.
I understand the need for a vent on drain pipes. In houses, we put a P-trap under the outlet of water draining things to create an air-lock so that sewer gases do not enter the house. This is a sink draining to the outside, there is no black water here and no sewer. I don't actually understand the need for a P-trap here. It seems to me that the need for the vent in this system is because of the (unneeded) P trap. If sink drains straight down through that existing hole---I'm hypothesizing that it used to do so---then the air above the sink prevents any vacuum in the drain line, right?
Let me try to do a better job teasing out the various related questions here:
1) I hypothesize that the little hole under the sink which goes to the outside used to be the sink drain. It can't be for the icebox---that's on the other side and it's still there. The other appliance on this side of the trailer is the oven. If that hole wasn't for the sink, what else could it have been for. Then again, why would someone decide to "improve" this by creating a p-trap and a vent and a hole in the side of the trailer where there (presumably) wouldn't have been one before.
2) Perhaps independently of (1), I have to decide to either repair the existing "drain out the side with a p trap" system. I can do this. I know how and it's relatively easy. Or replace it with a simple (and perhaps nicer, ultimately) system that simply drips to the ground under the trailer. In the case of the latter, I have to repair the holes in the trailer where the vent and outlet currently are.
Thanks again, everyone, for your wisdom!
|
|
vociferous
New Member
Posts: 17
Likes: 1
Currently Offline
|
Post by vociferous on May 14, 2024 8:36:29 GMT -8
|
|
John Palmer
Senior Member
Hi, From a vintage trailer guy located in Santa Ana, CA. It's good to see lots of activity here.
Posts: 1,706
Likes: 600
Currently Offline
|
Post by John Palmer on May 14, 2024 12:26:33 GMT -8
At todays prices for brass and copper plumbing parts, no previous owner spent the "big bucks" to buy brass tubing and cast bronze plumbing parts and then sweat soldered them together for a repair, In My Opinion. That white thin plastic P-Trap is the work of a previous owner, it not original like the rest of your drain system.
Should you ever take your trailer to any improved campground, or RV Park, they would never let you run an "open hose" out of your trailer and drain it into a tree well. Your adapter elbow on the outside of your trailer with a hose connected to it is assumed to be your sewer line. It's not going to cost you any more money, or time to repair the system and keep it "legal" to be used at any place you choose to camp at in the future. By using a P-Trap you can use a Blue Buddy and run your sewer hose into the Buddy and not have any smells coming out of your sink.
I know we all grumble about code enforcement rules on homeowners, but they are just looking out for us and the future owner of your house. Repairing a Travel Trailer should be done with the same kind of safety and comfort in mind. Let's just call it adopting a Best Practices approach.
Toss the cheap P-Trap and replace it with a more robust Schedule 40 ABS part. Fix your vent pipe and your system repairs are done.
John
|
|
vociferous
New Member
Posts: 17
Likes: 1
Currently Offline
|
Post by vociferous on May 14, 2024 13:15:43 GMT -8
Thanks, that's the kind of analysis I was looking for!
On my own rural property I will happily drain the grey water from biodegradable soap and toothpaste into my dirt road. But if I keep the P trap and vent me (or a future owner) can indeed hookup to a sewer system. Then I just need to plug the hole where (I suspect) the original sink drain was.
This is a 1960, so it's fully possible that someone wanted to "upgrade" the drain to the valterra outlet and built the brass drain system and then a subsequent owner replaced part of it with the plastic parts.
By the way, if you don't believe that that hole under the sink to the spot in front of the wheel was the original sink drain, do you have any other ideas? It really can't have been for the icebox.
|
|
|
|
Post by vikx on May 14, 2024 13:25:03 GMT -8
I think the hole by the wheel was an inlet for city water. My B & B had the inlet in that location. Also, the copper line you show may have a split at the green discoloration. Check carefully; splits are hard to see or feel. I see nothing wrong with draining straight down. To me, it is easier and less danger of a freezing trap. You may need a bigger hole for the drain. I go directly off the sink drain with a rubber Fernco connector to reducer and use 3/4" tractor "breather tube" as a flexible drain. It works really well. Under the trailer, I plug the tube with a barb to 3/4 garden hose connector and cap that to keep the bugs at bay. The threads also allow you to connect a garden hose to direct the drain water. <a data-flickr-embed="true" href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/53634851@N03/49938808426/in/album-72157683745666552/" title="006 r Kitt Plumbing (4)"><img src="https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49938808426_d100d665a3_z.jpg" width="640" height="480" alt="006 r Kitt Plumbing (4)"/></a><script async src="//embedr.flickr.com/assets/client-code.js" charset="utf-8"></script> |
|
vociferous
New Member
Posts: 17
Likes: 1
Currently Offline
|
Post by vociferous on May 14, 2024 20:58:36 GMT -8
Thanks vikx, and thanks for the pictures. The idea of an inlet matches what seems to be a rigid pipe in the picture of that B&B for sale. Although I do wonder how that ones drains (maybe straight down next to the inlet). I suppose that if I abandon the side attachments then I have more work to do to patch them, and fixing the broken fitting there doesn't prevent me from going straight down in the future if I really want to. So now I'm leaning toward's John Palmer's plan to fix what's there (and go ahead and plug the existing hole so nothing can come up through it.
|
|
