diymom
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enthralled with my 1969 Terry, problem is it keeps me awake at night planning
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1969 terry 18'
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Post by diymom on Sept 15, 2015 7:01:42 GMT -8
Last night it started to rain. I made my husband go out and close the trailer Windows because I had left them open. That did little to stop the leaks. There are a ton of leaks, both sides where the roof meets the walls toward the front of the trailer are leaking....now I know why they installed a new panel over the old...the bunk up there has water on it at both ends. The Windows on the same walls, lower down leak profusely through the old seals, draining down the inside lip into the wood below, the kitchen window is really leaky, I think the most constant drip of all...the whole roof over the refrigerator and over into the kitchen cabinets is soaked....the cabinets are wet inside a little. The roof vent leaks, duh, and it will obviously need to be replaced. And....It's still raining. Hard.
Sooooooo, my question is, how do I take out the kitchen cabinets and that area and keep them in tact?
Now my plan is to take the entire wall from the drivers side front to the back bathroom out, all cabinets too and do the same on the opposite wall up to the middle of the dinet window. I will have to replace the ceiling above the refrigerator area and up front too.
I just don't know how I'll do it. I have two little kids I have to care for, and I can't keep my trailer in my driveway. I would either have to rent a place nearby and get a babysitter, which I don't have money for, or this will take years to do and every free moment.
I'm pretty upset, I know I was too trusting of people I never met, telling me the trailer had no leaks, I paid too much for a restoration project, went too far out of the way to get it and my budget is maxed after the "trailer place" in as put on new tires, gave it a tow, repacked the bearings and fixed the brakes and i bought the battery system, propane stuff and sealants for the roof and sides...I can barely afford to get it registered.
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nccamper
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1962 Forester- 1956 Shasta
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Post by nccamper on Sept 15, 2015 7:30:47 GMT -8
That's rough. People can't be trusted. That's rule one.
Trustworthy people often don't know what they're talking about. That's rule two.
With that said, I think it's always best to move slowly. Getting it to stop leaking is the top priority. Time for a tarp and a night off to think calmly.
Once it's covered I'd use a dehumidifier (if you have one) to dry it out. Direct sun for a couple of days worked for me once.
Just because it leaked doesn't mean the wood is ruined. I learned that on our Shasta Compact. Sealing windows and jrail is easy and cheap.
One step at a time.
Not what you want to hear, is it?
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Post by vintagebruce on Sept 15, 2015 8:02:10 GMT -8
The important thing right now is to not totally despair, AND get at least an intermediate quality full length tarp over it until you get some dry weather to start the drying out process as nccamper suggested.
Your experience makes me wonder whether we ought to add, request a water hose so that you can thoroughly "flood" the roof of a camper as part of the physical inspection process. If there was no obvious signs of previous leaking and no tell-tale "damp" smell, I believe the seller was involved in misrepresentation of the condition of their camper to prospective buyers. That is my sole opinion, to which I am entitled. That camper came from a region "thought" to produce "dry" vintage campers.
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diymom
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enthralled with my 1969 Terry, problem is it keeps me awake at night planning
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1969 terry 18'
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Post by diymom on Sept 15, 2015 8:03:44 GMT -8
I'm really getting down, I just can't figure out how I am going to work on this thing! I can't do it at home...It's not legal to park in my own driveway. Aside from that, I have the little ones, and no money for and nobody to babysit until after 6 and that will be after dark soon, even if I only bring it home on the weekends to work on. Our free storage is 80miles south and it takes over 60$ in gas average to take it down and drive home or dive there and bring it back.
I don't know if I should just clean it up and sell it or what! I'll probably lose 1500+ bucks!
I really like a lot about the trailer, but I don't think i can fix it all!!! It will take years!
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diymom
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enthralled with my 1969 Terry, problem is it keeps me awake at night planning
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1969 terry 18'
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Post by diymom on Sept 15, 2015 9:24:52 GMT -8
Ugh, we never have rain in September! It's an el Nino year which means it should be really wet all fall, winter and spring. I need to start sealing now. The unusual weather means I will probably not be able to work on the trailer exterior sometimes, even when I carve out time... So do I seal things up first? I need a ladder to start fixing the roof, I'll have to buy one along with that tarp. Recommendations on the type of tarp and ladder?  ? |
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nccamper
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Post by nccamper on Sept 15, 2015 9:58:50 GMT -8
Unless there are holes in the roof, sealing it means putty tape along the edges under jrail and around the vent. A day job. Removing the windows to seal them with putty, another day unless the wood is rotten around them.
You don't need a big ladder. A six foot ladder is what I use for most project. A milk crate works for most putty work except the vent.
First things first, a tarp and sunshine to dry it out. While drying pull the tarp off and open the windows and door (if possible) to avoid mold.
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diymom
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enthralled with my 1969 Terry, problem is it keeps me awake at night planning
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1969 terry 18'
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Post by diymom on Sept 15, 2015 11:35:34 GMT -8
Oh, good idea on the mold thing...should I drill holes to ventilate the wet insulation on the panels I'll be replacing? I'm taking the screwed up added roof panel off as soon as my kids' naps sync or when my mom gets here around 6. I'm going to put a heater fan on high in there and some "dries the air" stuff in the cabinets and near the walls, open it all up and hope it dries fast. I can't quite believe that the j rails could be causing that much leakage!!! I don't think it's possible for that seam putty to seal it all up! Oh, should I replace the rail here? <a href="http://s1310.photobucket.com/user/candy59cars/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20150914_141008_zps1ravlgtd.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i1310.photobucket.com/albums/s645/candy59cars/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20150914_141008_zps1ravlgtd.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo IMG_20150914_141008_zps1ravlgtd.jpg"/></a> I really don't want to, I was hoping I could sorta straighten it out. |
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Post by danrhodes on Sept 15, 2015 13:10:10 GMT -8
Hi diymom ... I can really relate to your frustration (and your amazement at September rain...you must be in CA in an HOA). We also have 2 little ones at home, so are working on our trailer very slowly, in an hour here or there on the weekends. From your descriptions, it sounds like your trailer is probably much more structurally sound than ours (now just a metal frame) in the driveway (talk about overwhelming) so you have some good, front line things you can do as described by nccamper above. Just keep plugging away at it...anything you do to help can only retain more resale value if your situation finally does become untenable. BTW, I'm not an expert, but those J-rails look terrible to me. Perhaps someone cranked down the screws to minimize the leaks in the past, but I'm guessing if you look up at the top, you'll see they made lots of little pockets to collect the water. Luckily this aluminum is pretty easy to work with and you can probably get them pretty straight while you're replacing the putty. Finally, if that is the condition that the trailer was sold to you without disclosure, you're probably going to get some recommendations to lift the lower skins, or at least poke around under with an icepick for rot. Leaking is one thing, but unsafe to tow with a car full of kids is another. There's lots of good folks and good info here, and people of all skill levels, even me, can work on these simple boxes. |
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turbodaddy
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Post by turbodaddy on Sept 15, 2015 15:33:59 GMT -8
Hi DYI.
All of the above is really good advice. I was pretty overwhelmed at first,too. Our camper was cosmetically compromised, but fortunately after lifting the skins and pulling all of the rails and windows, we only found a couple of rotted areas that were pretty simple to repair. The re-puttying process is not hard to do and doesn't cost much. You can keep the tarp on and just do a section as time allows.
The following is something I grabbed from a website VintageTrailers.com. I bookmarked it under the title "Reassurance" and re-read it several times during the year and one half it took to finish (well, almost!) the work. My advice is not to make any drastic decisions. Take a breath and give yourself a chance to really evaluate how you might proceed.
From VintageTrailers.com:
"The prospect of saving a vintage camper or vintage trailer and restoring her to her former glory is an alluring and romantic one. It has seized many an individual, and offers emotional, spiritual, and sometimes practical rewards, to those whose wisdom and skill are up to the task.
A small percentage of people actually purchase vintage campers or vintage trailers for the restoration project itself, and we say more power to them. However, for most of us, a restoration is a way to get a quality built camper with true craftsmanship, charm and character instead of the other option you get when you go to your local RV dealer. If the point is in fact the result more than the process, we strongly suggest what we call a camping restoration. That is the restoration work is executed in projects small enough that they can each be completed during the winter months. The camper hits the road for a season's use every year. There are multiple benefits to this approach. Getting use out of the camper each year keeps the enthusiasm level way up, and the focus practical. In many cases a camper in this type of program seems to be fixed up faster than others because this yearly infusion of energy keeps the project from stalling. If the trailer is always close to being ready to camp in, her value stays up and gradually improves. It never takes the big dip (mentioned in the full body of the article) in connection with full-scale restorations. Materials costs occur in smaller lumps spread over greater time periods, and are easier to justify when they follow on the heels of a nice camping season. Routine maintenance of the trailer as needed for seasonal use will keep the trailer as a whole from declining while the focus of the restoration is in one particular area. If a restoration firm is doing the work, the costs will be much easier for most people to deal with, as they are spread over time. Last but not least, spouses, children, and partners who are more enthused about camping or traveling than trailer work will continue to support your efforts and understand their value.
In most cases there is a lot to be gained by using your project trailer before you either make changes in her or begin a broad-scale restoration. Very often the virtues of a trailer as she was designed and built are not obvious at first, and some feature you think you will hate may actually turn out to be desirable. When you purchase a camper you may feel that a certain problem is the most important item to attend to, but after camping in her other problems may seem more urgent. Even more importantly, you may find you don't like the trailer for some reason or that your needs are different than you first thought, and this will guide you toward a different project. In any case it is well if these realizations occur before a lengthy restoration, not after."
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nccamper
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Post by nccamper on Sept 15, 2015 16:16:33 GMT -8
Great advice from everyone.
"I can't quite believe that the j rail could be causing that much leakage!!!"
Sure it can.
I just bought a camper with a leaking vent because it had dried out putty. To look at the damage you would think a monsoon swept over it. But water wears away mountains one drop at a time.
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davek
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Post by davek on Sept 15, 2015 19:07:15 GMT -8
I hate to be Debbie downer but if your trailer needs a full rebuild it might be better to send it along to a new owner and save up for somthing in better shape. I am almost 6 months into rebuilding mine spending almost evey moment I am not at work working on it. I still probably have 3 months left befoe it will be campable and not even 100% done not to mention spending $3000 in parts and supply's. Until you rebuild one it is really hard to comprehend just how many hours is really takes, if I had small kids in the house and a limted budget it would have taken me years and years to get to this point. If I had to start all over again I would have saved my money and bought something that had already been rebuild without question. There are great deals on rebuilt trailers if you shop around.
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SusieQ
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Post by SusieQ on Sept 15, 2015 19:14:46 GMT -8
First I want to tell you I'm very sorry what you thought you bought turned out to be something less. Limited with internet service here but I'll be following your story and hoping you find the right solutions. Get it covered, NOW, everything they said above.
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diymom
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enthralled with my 1969 Terry, problem is it keeps me awake at night planning
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Post by diymom on Sept 15, 2015 19:53:25 GMT -8
You will not believe what happened when my husband and I took off that ceiling panel, it was like a silly kids movie scene... The ceiling looked like this first You can tell the flange from the vent was recently messed with <a href="http://s1310.photobucket.com/user/candy59cars/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20150914_141251_zpsgelc9bhc.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i1310.photobucket.com/albums/s645/candy59cars/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20150914_141251_zpsgelc9bhc.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo IMG_20150914_141251_zpsgelc9bhc.jpg"/></a> We took down the curtain track and all sorts of funky screws, nails, trim and those ridiculous fussy on the bottom chair leg floor protectors... then I pushed up in the middle of the replacement panel to show my husband how much it looked like it was sagging... then...a waterfall. All the sudden all this water starts pouring out all over the bed, the floor, my feet, my arms. We pushed the panel back up but there was water everywhere! We got a bucket, about four full size beach towels and let the panel start to sag down...more water!!! In all, I imagine there were over two gallons. We peeled off the rest of the nails and bizarre fasteners that were hanging on and looked at the original panel...it was really wet but just on the bottom, the insulation was dry, no wood around the vent was rotted, just wet. The horrible repair made a lake in the ceiling, I guess how it worked out was fine, otherwise the leak would have gone all over the floor and bed. <a href="http://s1310.photobucket.com/user/candy59cars/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20150915_161432_zpsmytzjiqx.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i1310.photobucket.com/albums/s645/candy59cars/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20150915_161432_zpsmytzjiqx.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo IMG_20150915_161432_zpsmytzjiqx.jpg"/></a> I looked up on the roof after and saw remnants of duct tape around the base of the vent and a very obvious separation of seal a from the base of the vent and the roof. What gives? It's obvious that's not going to last 5 minutes in the Arizona heat let alone be waterproof! We did a tour in the trailer and did the push and knock on the walls routine...we figured out we can probably get away with replacing 5 panels and removing the upper kitchen cabinets and the whole refrigerator and heater enclosure and rebuilding it. We ice pic tested the outer edge f the floors, only the front corner on the street side has any rot and it's only for about eight inches long and two inches wide. It's still pretty solid. Everything else that got wet is still solid and not rippled or separating, just lightly stained. We will be painting due to the peeling synthetic veneer on various surfaces and I don't think we can match it. It's sinking in the level of work, I just spent 400$ on supplies, sealants, that eternabond tape for the five seams on my roof, proflex, dicor, gutter sealant, putty tape, New vent tops, New vent and all sorts of tools. I need to get a ladder and plastic putty knives and other little tools, osi sealer... this stuff adds up fast! I think if I can convince my sister to come over and watch my kids for a few hours every morning, that combined with naps will enable me to work for a little while each week on my own before it gets dark...doing this two weeks on, two weeks off may work with the neighbors at least for a while. It was pretty ridiculous what happened with the water today, we made good memories. I think in can do this, I just hope I can get it done soon so we can camp next summer. One of the best things this remodel will produce is some wiring reconfiguration so I can install a fantastic fan vent and some modern amenities, fit the refrigerator in better and clean up the heater and refrigerator access panel area from the inside. |
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Post by vintagebruce on Sept 16, 2015 7:57:17 GMT -8
You didn't by any chance print a copy of the CL ad for your camper did you? If so, I wonder if the wording might convey any deceptive comments that might be used in small claims court to recoup some of your loss. I believe I saw the ad and felt like it was saying there was little wrong with the camper. Good Luck!
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diymom
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enthralled with my 1969 Terry, problem is it keeps me awake at night planning
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Post by diymom on Sept 16, 2015 15:03:14 GMT -8
I'm not going to go to Arizona to fight for a few hundred dollars, not even for a thousand.
They lied lied lied. They said everything worked...how could they have verified that if there was no battery or propane hooked up? I asked about leaks...obviously they knew they were there or they wouldn't have put that stupid plastic bag and duct tape over the refrigerator vent and put up the roof skin!
I did not print out the ad, I wish I had. I only have some of the pictures. It just goes to show that like many have said before-don't buy a trailer sight unseen.
I am going to fix things up to my goal of 90%...100% being perfect. I will say that of all the wet wood I have found, nothing seems rotted, just very wet. I have all access vents open, the refrigerator closet roof vent "cover" off and some marine dehumidifier in there now.
It still is a very sound trailer and I know I will be able to make it very nice and possibly improve my handyman skills. I will be doing more with carpentry soon than I have done since I was a teenager.
Our goal with the trailer was to be able to use it safely for camping and staying on my dad's property over weekends and other short trips. I want it to be clean, dry and a comfortable 65-75 degrees inside most of the time. We also want to tow something attractive...so right now it massively fails! I'm over the disappointment of losing the originality inside, and I'm looking forward to a clean modern interior that fits my tastes and is very customized.
It's very sunny today and I got a little tan on my arms working on the roof, it was nice and breezy and I've already sanded, cleaned and premiered the heater vent, I'll paint it silver tonight and install it with stainless steel screws tomorrow after I suck out a mouse nest and some odd broken tools from behind the heater.
I am loving all the made in USA tags and stamps...even on the j rail has it..
The trailer is growing on me...It's very enjoyable working on something again, I hope I can devise a way to watch my kids while working on it and that my neighbors don't report me.
I am keeping an eye on the forecast!
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