Hugh
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Post by Hugh on Jul 23, 2013 8:52:29 GMT -8
I'm about to have electric brakes put on our 1955 Shasta 1500. Before I do I'd like to get everyone's opinions on the trade-offs. Shasta weights in at 2400 lb with a 250 lb tongue weight. Those are loaded weights, ready for camping. We're getting a new tow vehicle, a 2013 Xterra (mid August) so any modification will be aimed at this vehicle. [Want some real fun? Try to find a manual transmission Xterra. We finally had to talk the dealer into ordering one for us.]
After talking to the local trailer store, it seems we can't put brakes on the existing axle. There are plates for brakes but the added size of the drums won't allow removal/installation of the wheels. I believe this as it is hard to change tires as is due to wheel well clearance issues. It would be nice to move the current axle under the springs, raising the trailer some 3-4" but there are no locating holes in the top of the axle. Drilling a hole there would weaken the axle too much. SO, it's a new axle and we can get straight or 4" drop axles. The drop axle would put us right where we are. Thus it's a straight axle or a drop axle under the springs. Both raise the trailer 3-4" so the logical choice is the straight axle. Now for questions?
The current braking (2003 Toyota Tacoma 4x4 tow vehicle) seems workable but marginal. What are the thoughts on brakes for this sized trailer? Has anyone added brakes to an early vintage trailer?
Will the added 3-4" adversely affect handling? It's going the wrong direction but not raising the trailer much. We need to check the threshold to see if the step up is too large. I suspect with a higher step it'll be fine. 3-4" more road clearance would be nice. We've had few problems with clearance as yet but haven't taken here on many dirt roads yet.
I appreciate your thoughts. Thanks.
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gonekayaking
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enjoying using my camper and not working on it anymore!
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1956 Shasta 1500
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Post by gonekayaking on Jul 23, 2013 9:21:47 GMT -8
Hi Hugh
I'm looking forward to the brake discussion here...I have the same query for my 56 1500--though my dry weights is less than 1500# and loaded still comes in below 2K. We tow with a Nissan Frontier V6 which I think is the same capacity as the Xterra-- had to go with an automatic at the time because there wasn't one with a manual transmission in California (so I believe you)! I don't have trailer brakes now and have been using downshifting as my primary method for slowing on downgrades, and have found my brakes to be more than adequate, but have brakes on my list for the next chunk of dough, realizing it means changing out the axle.
I did move the drop axle under the springs and got a few inches out of it-- more like 3 definitely not 4. The measurement from ground to the bottom of the frame is 14" now, I made a 10 inch step which gives me another 10 inch step into the trailer...feels just right. I don't recall that we had to drill into the axle at all, but there was some retrofit made on the u bracket. This was essential because I literally couldn't back it into the driveway without bottoming out. There has been no adverse affect on handling, it tows straight and smooth.
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chukar52
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Post by chukar52 on Jul 23, 2013 9:34:15 GMT -8
Hi Hugh,
We should have talked about this in Mitchell. I ended up putting my original axle under the springs (along with new replacement springs) and was very happy with the resulting height. I did drill an index hole for the springs, but only needed about 1/4", and decided that was going to be OK. I have found no difference in handling, and pull our 56 Shasta 1500 with a Toyota Highlander. I might notice the slightest wiggle above 65 mph, but don't think it's prudent to drive faster than 60 when towning so it's just not an issue. I have brakes but currently they are not being used, and I'm not sure at this point whether I'll go ahead and rewore for them or not. I too would welcome input on this. The added clearance has solved lots of problems, and I can actually change a tire without letting the air out, a big plus in my book!
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Ten
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70 Shasta 16SC + 1964 Airflyte
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Post by Ten on Jul 23, 2013 13:58:51 GMT -8
Speaking only from personal opinion, and only to the brakes themselves and not the clearance and handling issues, I would always lean toward having working brakes. Period. It is generally much more important to stop than it is to go when it comes to towing.
Imagine for a moment the size of the brakes on an Xterra. Now imagine them working in an extreme braking situation, like a light suddenly goes red, or you are about to go over a cliff...or a child suddenly appears in the roadway on her tricycle.
Now add the trailer weight as dead weight to the weight of the Xterra, nearly doubling your vehicle weight, but with no added braking power.
How'd ya make out with that cliff? How is the child on the tricycle?
After driving heavy trucks for several years, and being in some hairy situations, as well as seeing every style of idiot out there that you have to share the road with, I would alwaysalwaysALWAYS advocate for working brakes, no matter how much of a feat of engineering they may be.
By the way, Hi Hugh!
Good to see you over here
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Post by vikx on Jul 23, 2013 21:20:04 GMT -8
Interesting discussion.
Of our two 1957 1500s, one has brakes, the other doesn't. The axles look identical. Sundance has no brakes and the wheels and tires fit very well, on and off the hubs. Butch Cassidy has factory brakes and the wheels are a very tight fit-hard to mount and dismount.
I agree that brakes are a necessary addition. A few inches higher wouldn't hurt if you can stop.
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Post by bigbill on Jul 24, 2013 3:32:06 GMT -8
Number ten you are right on, It can't be stated any better than that.
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Hugh
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Post by Hugh on Jul 26, 2013 7:32:00 GMT -8
It sounds like raising the trailer 3-4" isn't a big factor in handling. We took a couple of 3 1/2" bricks and put them at the threshold finding the added step up is workable. It's a bigger step up but split between the step stool and into the trailer it'd be fine. A little more clearance for driveways and pot holes would be appreciated. Number Ten and vikx feel brakes are needed. From our own experience, our Shasta 1500 towed with a Toyota Tacoma, braking is marginal. If you drive ahead and anticipate what's going on it's workable. But as for emergencies, well.......
So, we decided to install brakes. Our wheel well clearance is about like vikx. I replaced the springs during renovation since the originals had sagged. Before replacing them it was very difficult to remove/install a wheel. After it's quite doable but not overly easy. Just adding brake drums would cause trouble. I'm not comfortable drilling a second locating hole in the original axle. That would weaken the axle right where the stress is worst and a fatigue failure (cyclic stress) would be very bad, a wheel would fall off unpredictably. So it's a new straight axle for us. I ordered the parts through a local trailer shop. I'll likely have them install the axle, I don't think I'm up to crawling under the trailer and lifting the axle into place. I could but it might be painful. I do plan to do the wiring though.
I'll let you all know how it turns out. If nothing else it'll give us some peace of mind on the road.
Thank you all for the advise.
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Hugh
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Post by Hugh on Sept 21, 2013 8:58:31 GMT -8
Well, we followed through with brakes for Shasta. I had the trailer shop install a new straight axle with brakes. This raised the trailer as anticipated which is noticeable getting in and out but not a real problem. It doesn't look too high on the road as seen below. We received our new Xterra and are quite pleased with it. We didn't tow Shasta with Terra using the old axle, but the combination works very well with the new axle. Towing with Terra seems slightly more stable than with the old Tacoma. With the Tacoma it was comfortable to 55 or maybe 60, with Terra it feels the same at 60 & 65. I believe this improvement is due to a shorter distance between the rear wheels and the trailer ball. As an aside, Terra has a readout for miles per gallon! Towing we get right at 14mpg travelling 57mph and 11+ travelling at 62mph. Travelling at 55+ is real comfortable and will likely be our default rate. Terra came with a Nissan Nevada Towing Package. This made adding a brake controller easy. The package provided a 7pin plug wired for a brake controller and a plug under the dash also for a brake controller. I ordered a Tekonsha Primus IQ progressive brake controller from ETrailer along with a pig tail plug for the XTerra. It is a mid-range controller, for up to 3 axles. The plug matched Terra directly and the controller worked instantly. The hardest part was drilling two holes and mounting the brake controller bracket. The controls and set-up were simple by following the directions. Having trailer brakes is a great safety improvement. With the brakes the combination stops on par with Terra alone. I'd highly recommend the modification for anyone with a 1500 Shasta. I feel much safer the brakes and would recommend it to anyone with a 1500 or larger trailer. It wasn't cheep though. The axle was $446, brake controller $110+shipping and maybe $35 for trailer plug and wiring. So about $600 total. But again I think worth it for my peace of mind towing. Thank you all for the input and help. |
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Post by bigbill on Sept 21, 2013 16:40:28 GMT -8
Hugh I firmly believe that the total you paid is very cheap compared to what you would have to live with if that little one on a tricycle as mentioned above rode out in front of you. I wish to applaud you for adding the brakes, job well done. Also nice looking rig.
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