annbclay
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1961 Shasta Compact
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Post by annbclay on Jun 5, 2014 8:36:16 GMT -8
I've been reading a lot of threads in this forum and am getting confused! I could use a bit of staright forward direction!
i won't be boon docking much so I don't need too much 12 volt rigging. I have several specific questions about setting up 12 volt in my shasta compact...
1) i was given a really nice AGM sealed battery. I'd like to hid it in my shasta compact under the seating, inside the cabinet beside the wheel. Is this safe? Is there something I need to do to make it safe?
2) I want to hook my ventilation ceiling fan up to it. If I do JUST THAT ONE THING do I still need a fuse box?
3) if I'd decide to add a double 12 volt receptacle for charging cell phone, iPad or running a very small extra fan what is the minimum wiring I need to do. Is there a diagram somewhere I can follow? I don't really want the hassle of connecting this system to my car for recharging. I will instead recharge when I am home with a purchased charger for this purpose.
4) do I need a 2wire or 2 wire plus ground set up? If just 2 wire do I connect to positive/negative or positive/frame?
5) What are the correct colors for this type of wiring?
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John Palmer
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Hi, From a vintage trailer guy located in Santa Ana, CA. It's good to see lots of activity here.
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Post by John Palmer on Jun 5, 2014 14:23:18 GMT -8
You want to begin with a system that will be a basic workable system, but will also work as you choose to add things as you grow your trailer. The following "suggestions" are based on real world experience.
Start with a good quality "Industry Standard" seven way plug (female) on your tow vehicle, and a male plug on your trailer. I like to use the molded plugs, but they are more expensive. You might not ever use every terminal on the plug, but it will allow you to tow any trailer, or in a pinch it will allow your trailer to be towed by any other "seven way plug" vehicle. You want to adopt the "Industry Standard" wire color code, wire gauge size, and wire connection pattern, again so it's going to be interchangeable with any trailer, or tow vehicle.
By using the seven colors given on the tow plug, you can "fill in" with other colors for systems inside your trailer. The concept is that you should be able to look at any wire in your trailer and know exactly where it started, and where it goes from just the color. It does not cost any more to wire it with different colors. Make sure that you continue to use white as your common 12v ground color through out the trailer, just the same as found on the seven way plug. You need to run a ground wire to every accessory, do not cheap out and expect the skin to serve as your ground.
You want to have a 12v fuse panel, for the same reason as you would have a 110v fuse (circuit breaker) panel. It's for your safety, and to protect your wiring from melting if shorted out. Yes, you have to have two wires to make a completed circuit for anything to work with electricity. The power needs to start at the positive post of the battery, go to your accessory, and return to the negative post on the battery for anything to work. Fuses and switches are necessary extras to make it easy and safe to turn on accessories.
The best way to keep the battery charged is to have redundant systems that are automatic. They do not require you to monitor them, or to remember to turn on and off chargers. Since you have a charging system on your tow vehicle, just run one wire to the seven way plug and you now have a simple way to charge your trailer battery all the time your towing it. The tow vehicle has a regulator that will not exceed 14.3 volts, which is a full charge for a 12 volt battery. The next thing you need is a battery maintainer. It costs me about $38.00 for a "generic brand" 2.5MA maintainer at an electronics store. Any time the trailer is plugged into a 110v source the battery maintainer will monitor the trailer battery and provide a charge if necessary up to 14.3 volts. These are both regulated systems and require no effort on your part. Lead (same as AGM) batteries do not like to have heavy discharges, and heavy recharges. If they see this kind of use, the sulfate and over time they will not take, or hold a charge. For under $40.00 you can have a simple, safe, and easy to use system.
Vikx has a wiring diagram somewhere on this site that will give you a simple wiring diagram that will get you started.
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annbclay
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1961 Shasta Compact
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Post by annbclay on Jun 5, 2014 18:26:57 GMT -8
Wow, thank you so much John, I will do that. I am going on a trip, leaving next Tuesday and am not certain I will have time to do all of that properly before I leave. Until then I just need my ventilation fan to work.
My camper has a 7 way plug on it already, the tow vehicle has a 4 way plug with a 7 way adaptor on it. If I buy a fuse box and run wire from the battery to fuse box and fuse box to ventilation fan with a ground wire going to the frame, will I be okay? Then when I return I can have the tow vehicle wiring changed to a full 7 way receptacle and properly install my accessories and the maintenance systems you suggest. Think this will work?
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Bow_Tied
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Post by Bow_Tied on Jun 5, 2014 18:48:13 GMT -8
For a temporary install, you could use a simple in-line fuse in the 12V+ wire. Be sure to put the fuse as close to the battery as possible as the fuse will only provide protection between itself and the power draw. Putting the fuse close to the fan won't protect the run of wire (in case it got knicked and shorted etc.) Make sure wire connections are tight and wires are routed so they are protected from damage or getting caught on moving things.
Do you know how to select the proper wire type, gauge and fuse size? If not you may find this info in the fan manual. Too small of wire or too large of fuse could cause trouble.
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annbclay
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Post by annbclay on Jun 5, 2014 19:28:17 GMT -8
Great, thank you, yes I understand about wire gauge and fuses. I've just never worked with 12 volt except with an inverter and then recharging the battery in my garage.
Can I place the battery inside the camper under the seats in the wheel well storage area or is that too small an area? Does gassing occur when being used or only during charging?
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Post by bigbill on Jun 5, 2014 19:36:20 GMT -8
An AGM battery won't cause you any problems with gassing they are made to be used in wheelchairs inside of homes that is why they are sealed they can even go inside the passenger compartment on an airliner.
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annbclay
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Post by annbclay on Jun 5, 2014 20:03:12 GMT -8
Wonderful!! Thank you all so much!
let me just make certain I understand before I go buy supplies.
I'll want a 3 strand 16 to 14 gauge wire (ground, a negative and positive lines) and an in line fuse of appropriate amps wired in next to the battery. Later on I will reconfigure with a full fuse panel and the 7 way plug.
Does that sound correct?
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John Palmer
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Hi, From a vintage trailer guy located in Santa Ana, CA. It's good to see lots of activity here.
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Post by John Palmer on Jun 5, 2014 21:44:56 GMT -8
Wonderful!! Thank you all so much! let me just make certain I understand before I go buy supplies. I'll want a 3 strand 16 to 14 gauge wire (ground, a negative and positive lines) and an in line fuse of appropriate amps wired in next to the battery. Later on I will reconfigure with a full fuse panel and the 7 way plug. Does that sound correct? Where did the "3 Strand idea" come from?
Ground, and Negative are the same wire on a 12v system. Don't confuse 12v DC wiring, with 110v AC wiring.
A Fantastic fan pulls very little in amps. A 16G wire will be fine with nothing larger than a 7.5 to 10 amp fuse.
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Bow_Tied
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Post by Bow_Tied on Jun 6, 2014 7:35:32 GMT -8
X2
Only two wires, negative (ground) and postive, for 12V. Just like the terminals on the battery.
Adding a ground wire from the fan chassis to the trailer chassis would not hurt anything but is not needed.
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annbclay
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Post by annbclay on Jun 6, 2014 16:12:19 GMT -8
Ok, I thought somewhere I read something about negative and ground wires.
Thanks so much everyone. Now I'm off to the propane forum!
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capnjonny
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1965 Shasta Compact
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Post by capnjonny on Jun 28, 2014 5:08:52 GMT -8
Good advice you have gotten.
I would only add one thing. Make sure all your wiring is with "primary " wire. That is multi strand copper wire like you would see on your car. Never use solid wire like Romex on a car or boat. The constant motion while moving will fatigue the wire and it may break. You should be able to find "primary" wire at any auto supply. If you are going to do extensive wiring you should purchase it on line in 50 or 100 ft spool as often the wire at the auto store is in short lengths and you will come up short for longer runs.
On my 65 Compact I put the 30 amp agm battery under the drivers side settee in front of the wheel tub. To keep it from moving around I built a tight fitting battery box out of plywood and screwed it to the floor.
Capnjonny
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annbclay
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Post by annbclay on Jun 29, 2014 7:05:35 GMT -8
Thanks for last tips
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jannica
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Post by jannica on Jul 8, 2014 5:54:56 GMT -8
I'm glad you posted this thread because I was wondering the same thing! I bought a Fantastic Vent for my Shasta Compact, not even thinking that I don't have a 12v system set up yet in the camper. Doh! I was planning to add one later and just have the standard 110 electrical system that has to be plugged into shore power for now. Just realized that I can't use the fan without a 12v battery. I'm hoping to get it set up properly soon so I can use it!
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Post by bigbill on Jul 8, 2014 12:14:18 GMT -8
jannica if you don't want a 12 volt battery you can power the fan with a 12 volt power supply that runs off you 110.
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jannica
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Post by jannica on Jul 8, 2014 13:33:30 GMT -8
jannica if you don't want a 12 volt battery you can power the fan with a 12 volt power supply that runs off you 110. How does that work? Would I still need a battery or is there some type of converter I could use? |
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