roadtripper
Active Member
Posts: 311 
Likes: 116
Currently Offline
|
Post by roadtripper on Jan 6, 2018 20:49:28 GMT -8
All my electric is finally done. (See a detail posted tonight in the Vintage Restorations section.) I have one little issue and I think its the bulbs, but I'll throw it out there. I kept 4 original interior fixtures that were 120 and changed to 12v. I put in new porcelain screw in receptacles for standard bulbs. I used the old switches which checked out fine I think. All wiring is new stranded 14 guage with hot and ground to everything. I got 12 volt led bulbs that screw in...about 5 watt I think.
I don't think it happened immediately, but when you turn them on most of the time they flicker on and off, or high and low, real fast. I think its the bulbs. Here is what i've tried.
Shore power only through the converter with the battery switched off.
Battery power only with the 120 input off.
Thought maybe 14 too small. Today I put some #10 stranded on to test and no different.
Took my 12 v. light tester and clipped wire to ground and stuck pin to hot spot in socket and no flicker.
Seems if it was something besides the bulb the test light should act funny.
The battery checks out good with my multi meter at the battery and at the light fixture. The battery monitor and the guage on blue tooth show good. All show within about 2 1/100 of a volt.
In this little town I can't just run down and get another bulb so before I go back to Amazon, anyone have any ideas?
Is there a way to keep the nice old fixtures and convert to regular led bulbs...if it comes to that?
Thanks, Mike
|
|
|
|
Post by vikx on Jan 6, 2018 21:12:14 GMT -8
Sounds to me that it might be the bulbs. Some LEDs need a capacitor. Also, the bulbs can be well made or not. Here is a link to some discussion: www.rvforum.net/SMF_forum/index.php?topic=85753.0Not sure on converting the fixtures back to 110 if that's what you meant by regular LED bulbs. If you rewired, the 110 wiring is gone? If so, no ground. You would also have to disconnect each old fixture completely from the 12 volt system or there could be an interesting reaction... You can make an adapter to see if another type of bulb will not flicker. Use one of the screw in adapters that a normal 2 prong extension plugs into. Plug into the adapter with the wires wing-nutted to another 12 volt fixture. If the different bulb doesn't flicker, that will answer questions. Good luck and keep us informed. |
|
charliemyers
Active Member
Posts: 181
Likes: 58
Currently Offline
|
Post by charliemyers on Jan 7, 2018 4:45:57 GMT -8
Can you post a pic of your LED bulbs? I’m inclined to suspect the bulbs as well.
5W / 12V = .417 amps so 14 gauge wire can easily handle the current.
How many bulbs are you talking about? Does it do this with just one bulb? And when you say that they flicker “real fast”, just how fast? Slow enough to notice but too fast to count? Couple times a second? Is it a consistent flicker or does it vary?
|
|
nccamper
Administrator 
Posts: 7,744
Likes: 2,871
1962 Forester- 1956 Shasta
Currently Offline
|
Post by nccamper on Jan 7, 2018 6:05:39 GMT -8
I wonder if it's the converter.
"Here is what i've tried.
Shore power only through the converter with the battery switched off.
Battery power only with the 120 input off."
Did you bypass the converter and power with just the battery?
--
|
|
roadtripper
Active Member
Posts: 311
Likes: 116
Currently Offline
|
Post by roadtripper on Jan 7, 2018 7:49:00 GMT -8
Thanks all. Vikx, good link there. I'll read it again and see what I can weed out, but obviously others have same problem. By "regular" I just meant the bulbs like the BA15s on VTS for example. Not sure how I could place the new socket in the vintage cone style fixture though.
Charlie, The bulb brand is chichin. It does it with all bulbs, though it didn't start on one of the 4 till after a few days of messing around with them. The pulse is maybe 2 or 3 times a second but varies to a little faster to not at all for a few seconds. Enough to drive you crazy if you were dependent on them.
(which we will be soon as we actually get to quit working and go camping).
NC, I bypassed the converter in that I shut the 30a 120 side main off and the 15a 120 side breaker to the converter.
Converter is brand new PD 4045. You'd think that wouldnt be the problem.
Guess I could try 12v screw in incandescent bulbs. More amps to use but might work better.
Thanks again everyone for the input.
|
|
|
|
Post by vikx on Jan 7, 2018 12:00:32 GMT -8
If you want to try the incandescent 12 volt bulb, try just one. They are very greedy and will suck power. I've never liked them. If the flicker is gone, you know it's the bulbs.
As said, a temporary adapter will allow you to test with another type of fixture/socket and bulb.
|
|
|
|
Post by bigbill on Jan 7, 2018 14:53:39 GMT -8
It could also be an old switch arcing as the load increases. A meter sometimes doesn't create enough load to activate a problem. Also it could be the final ground connection not making a solid connection. Remember DC requires a good connection to both positive and negative. To test your bulbs remove them and wire direct to a battery source and see if they flicker.
|
|
jukebox
Member
Posts: 43
Likes: 9
1961 Shasta Airflyte
Currently Offline
|
Post by jukebox on Jan 7, 2018 15:36:34 GMT -8
I agree that the switch could be suspect of a problem. The switch is just that it has a contact blade inside that shorts across the contacts when switched on. If there is resistance on the switch contacts then you can have flicker issues.
Is the flickering lights flickering at some sort of patttern? Like bright/dim at same time intervals? If this seems liek it has a pattern then suspect the bulbs or inverter/converter.
Have you verified the voltage at the bulb socket with a multimeter and watch voltage fluctuations? An LED bulb can flicker and display these symptoms because they simply can. An incandescent bulb will not display these characteristics because it is to slow to respond and you cannot see it with your eyes in most cases. 60HZ frequency can be seen with LED's.
Can you swap out the bulbs you bought with a known good LED one? Putting in a incandescent bulb will not help you with this problem.
Similar issue. I changed out all my basement potlight bulbs with LED ones. I noticed a couple of things.
First when used with a dimmer they won't turn on unless the dimmer is set to full bright. I also noticed that they would hum and flicker when dimmed even though is clearly says on the package that they are dimmable. I researched this abit and found that you have to use a LED compliant dimmer switch. So, I replaced one dimmer and the new LED bulbs worked great. They would even turn on in full dim mode. Of course I had to try it. I replaced all the dimmers and now work great.
$23 for each dimmer. I guess my cost savings is delayed with the new LED bulbs.
|
|
roadtripper
Active Member
Posts: 311
Likes: 116
Currently Offline
|
Post by roadtripper on Jan 7, 2018 18:47:00 GMT -8
Per suggestion I eliminated everything but the bulb and battery. I took a couple of 14 ga wires with alligator clips on each end and went right to the battery. I clipped one on each post and touched the pos and ground points on the screw in bulb and got the same flicker. So the next thing will be to try a different brand of led screw in I guess. Since I have 4 different light fixtures that were originally 120, and all are behaving the same I think its unlikely that all the switches and all the grounds would be a problem.
When I tested the voltage at the light socket the readouts were consistent and no fluctuations that I could tell. For example I'd get a reading of say something like 12.65 and I wouldn't move. But what do I know? I'm just a carpenter.
Thanks again for all the input.
|
|
mobiltec
5K Member
I make mistakes so you don't have to...
Posts: 9,822
Likes: 3,749
1954 Jewel In Progress...
Currently Offline
|
Post by mobiltec on Jan 24, 2018 15:46:41 GMT -8
Per suggestion I eliminated everything but the bulb and battery. I took a couple of 14 ga wires with alligator clips on each end and went right to the battery. I clipped one on each post and touched the pos and ground points on the screw in bulb and got the same flicker. So the next thing will be to try a different brand of led screw in I guess. Since I have 4 different light fixtures that were originally 120, and all are behaving the same I think its unlikely that all the switches and all the grounds would be a problem. When I tested the voltage at the light socket the readouts were consistent and no fluctuations that I could tell. For example I'd get a reading of say something like 12.65 and I wouldn't move. But what do I know? I'm just a carpenter. Thanks again for all the input. It's the bulbs... Your test to the battery only confirms that. If they had flickered I might have gone back to the converter. Remember folks that the converters are not built to be used as a primary source of power. The converter is actually just a battery charger and your battery is the primary source of power. Also know that bad batteries that need replacement can make the converter act very funny with flickering and dim lights ect. And if used too long in that condition will ruin the converter all together. |
|
|
|
Post by vikx on Jan 24, 2018 21:11:10 GMT -8
Mobile is right! I had a converter (modern trailer) that made the lights do weird things and flicker without a battery. The battery acts as a buffer.
You eliminated that by going straight to the battery, bypassing everything else. Can you get just one bulb and see if the same thing happens?
|
|
roadtripper
Active Member
Posts: 311
Likes: 116
Currently Offline
|
Post by roadtripper on Jan 25, 2018 6:29:57 GMT -8
I’m trying to find a single bulb locally to try without having to get a package of several from amazon. All the local shops have the screw in incandescent only. VTS doesn’t cary them either. Thanks. I’ll keep you posted.
|
|
