diymom
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enthralled with my 1969 Terry, problem is it keeps me awake at night planning
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1969 terry 18'
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Post by diymom on May 26, 2014 22:02:03 GMT -8
Ok,I'm very new to towing things-i have driven vehicles with trailers like a few times...so i might sound-dumb. 1.) We just bought our first trailer-we towed it with our 2005 lifted ford f150 truck...when we got home and needed to park the trailer (is that what you do with trailers-park them?) I backed up the trailer into our driveway and my husband and i were freaked out that the rear corners of the truck were actually able to contact the trailer body-something we have never encountered with longer-tongues...though we never did try to back them up into our driveway... we don't want to have that problem-is there a tow hitch extension that is rated for something like my vintage trailer? Is it common to have this problem-or are we awful at backing up trailers? are there any other solutions? 2.) I am also wondering how many of you hook up and use trailer brakes-our truck is fairly heavy-we haven't had slowing with any problems with other trailers (flatbed, car hauler, etc). but I've seen "the long, long trailer" and I hear "trailer brakes first!!!!" echoing in my head when I think of our trailer which has brakes which are not hooked up. how important are they? FYI, we are planning on traveling through the rockies soon with the trailer-so I am particularly curious since I know there are lots of long periods of braking through the 6 hour trip in that mountain range. what would you recommend for that situation-pit stops for brake cooling? definite must on getting the brakes working? 3.) I have a classic car that I restored and have worked in the industry-that said-what the heck is up with the leaf springs on our 59 shasta? There is a loop on the bottom leaf that curls like a cinderella pumpkin carriage tendril down to the road and hovers not more than 2 inches off the ground!!! one side is broken off-because its obviously a crazy thing for a leaf spring to be doing!!! are my leafs shot and just needing replacement or is that some bizarre anti bottoming out thing for flat tire protection so the trailer doesn't flip? I've seen a million leaf springs for old trucks-but nothing like that! And do leafs really need replacement if they aren't technically broken? sorry for all the questions...I am spending my whole day and night thinking about this trailer now...like how I am a huge sucker who should have passed on this one and gone with something less---I don't know---in need of a total overhaul and then some because on top of it being in bad shape-long list I have so far, its been hot glued, painted, wall papered and has had a second layer of wood put over the---what I assume is major damage!!!!! oh yeah and termites....termite poop everywhere after a short 120 mile tow. My head is reeling.
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Post by vikx on May 26, 2014 22:52:16 GMT -8
Welcome Diymom. You are home.
First of all, get the undercarriage inspected; the springs may need to be replaced. Nope, the hang down isn't normal...sounds like it is broken? Do both springs; otherwise the trailer tends to sag on one side. Pictures are needed.
Brakes are important, especially in mountain driving. It's not difficult to connect them. Two wires from the brakes forward, one is ground, the other hot. Brake controller in the truck; modern ones are adjustable, so you should be able to control the amount of braking in the trailer.
Others will disagree, but I use a 12" extension every time I tow a trailer. It's the perfect length to keep from "jack-knifing" the trailer when backing and tight turns are possible. Stick with a 12" extension.
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John Palmer
Senior Member
Hi, From a vintage trailer guy located in Santa Ana, CA. It's good to see lots of activity here.
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Post by John Palmer on May 26, 2014 22:53:07 GMT -8
Ok,I'm very new to towing things-i have driven vehicles with trailers like a few times...so i might sound-dumb. 1.) We just bought our first trailer-we towed it with our 2005 lifted ford f150 truck...when we got home and needed to park the trailer (is that what you do with trailers-park them?) I backed up the trailer into our driveway and my husband and i were freaked out that the rear corners of the truck were actually able to contact the trailer body-something we have never encountered with longer-tongues...though we never did try to back them up into our driveway... we don't want to have that problem-is there a tow hitch extension that is rated for something like my vintage trailer? Is it common to have this problem-or are we awful at backing up trailers? are there any other solutions? 2.) I am also wondering how many of you hook up and use trailer brakes-our truck is fairly heavy-we haven't had slowing with any problems with other trailers (flatbed, car hauler, etc). but I've seen "the long, long trailer" and I hear "trailer brakes first!!!!" echoing in my head when I think of our trailer which has brakes which are not hooked up. how important are they? FYI, we are planning on traveling through the rockies soon with the trailer-so I am particularly curious since I know there are lots of long periods of braking through the 6 hour trip in that mountain range. what would you recommend for that situation-pit stops for brake cooling? definite must on getting the brakes working? 3.) I have a classic car that I restored and have worked in the industry-that said-what the heck is up with the leaf springs on our 59 shasta? There is a loop on the bottom leaf that curls like a cinderella pumpkin carriage tendril down to the road and hovers not more than 2 inches off the ground!!! one side is broken off-because its obviously a crazy thing for a leaf spring to be doing!!! are my leafs shot and just needing replacement or is that some bizarre anti bottoming out thing for flat tire protection so the trailer doesn't flip? I've seen a million leaf springs for old trucks-but nothing like that! And do leafs really need replacement if they aren't technically broken? sorry for all the questions...I am spending my whole day and night thinking about this trailer now...like how I am a huge sucker who should have passed on this one and gone with something less---I don't know---in need of a total overhaul and then some because on top of it being in bad shape-long list I have so far, its been hot glued, painted, wall papered and has had a second layer of wood put over the---what I assume is major damage!!!!! oh yeah and termites....termite poop everywhere after a short 120 mile tow. My head is reeling. #1) Check out the Hidden Hitch coupler #80232 from ETrailer.com. It's a 16" coupler extension. I have towed several different vintage trailers (they all have short tongues) with this coupler on my F150 and it works great. I was a little concerned that it might be "Too Long", and I redrilled it at 13". It's only about $20, and ETrailer is a great supplier.
#2) I have towed thousands of miles both with, and without trailer brakes. IMO, it's the best $500 you can spend to retro fit a trailer, and have a new 3500# axle, and hubs which gives you the larger 10" size brakes. It's very nice to just reach down to your brake controller and touch it, and be able to "apply the trailer brakes only" and it instantly removes any sway from a passing semi truck. I'm also a "new convert" to believing in the benefit of running a friction bar for stabilization, on these light trailers with a high side profile.
#3) Your curly cue's on your lower springs are most likely a safety device for flat tires to prevent the U Bolts from dragging the ground with a flat tire.
I have been told by a very good (seventy year old) spring shop that the steel in pre 1960's springs is much better quality than what you will buy today from China. That said, springs can sag, but can be brought back to good as new condition for about the same price as a crappy replacement spring. Also be aware that many 1950's trailers were built with Willy's Jeep springs from WW2 surplus parts. The problem with replacement springs is they will/might not have the same center to center distance as your original springs.
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Post by vikx on May 26, 2014 23:26:02 GMT -8
Thank you for your post, John!
I had no idea that the curly cues were a good thing.
diymom, can you post some photos, please??
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Post by bigbill on May 27, 2014 7:08:43 GMT -8
Yes these devices that hang down under the u bolts were very popular at one time,they are to help you maintain control in case of a blow out. There were many different designs made. As tires became better designed and special tires made for trailers became available they were no longer as popular of an accessory as people stopped using automobile tires on their trailers. Many people think they are broke off but usually on closer inspection they find they were ground off after a tire blew.
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Post by bigbill on May 27, 2014 7:20:23 GMT -8
Trailer hitch extensions are a wonderful thing BUT YOU MUST take into consideration that they decrease the allowable tongue weight of your hitch by approximately 1/3. On a truck or van with a class IV or better hitch you are probably ok, on a car or small SUV it may cause an overload on what the vehicle itself will support as far as tongue weight this is caused by the increase in leverage. Example you are trying to loosen a bolt and you can't turn it so you get a wrench with a foot longer handle and it is easier to turn, same principal on your hitch you have just gave the load more power to break your hitch or your vehicle. IF you aren't trained to back your trailer with the standard hitch I would suggest towing with a normal hitch then when you need to back it up change to a longer extension hitch, or spend the money to have the trailer tongue extended.
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diymom
Active Member
enthralled with my 1969 Terry, problem is it keeps me awake at night planning
Posts: 323
Likes: 51
1969 terry 18'
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Post by diymom on May 27, 2014 8:17:05 GMT -8
you guyss are amazing! this is great info! I thought those curly cues were there for a very specific reason-one side IS broken off about 5 inches-but it still hangs down below the u bolts so I think I will recondition the springs-new spring eye bushings... I am a firm believer in American steel from pre 1960-when the steel industry here was affected by mass striking and America went to Japan and other sources for steel. I Do agree that what is going to be available on the market is going to be inferior-I personally refurbish every thing I can on vintage items-I know where and how the replacement parts are made and they last about 1/10th the life of the original parts-with few exceptions. I'll be telling my husband this information-especially about the increased leverage that tow hitch extensions create-really good information I haven't found elsewhere. I'll check into my husband's tow equipment capacity.
I like the advantages with trailer brakes-I think they're probably a great investment for the length of trip and the type of terrain we will be covering-I can do the setup easily-I've done many drum brakes. I think-we will just need to add in the trailer brake regulating equipment to the truck. Man--costs sure are adding up FAST for what we had originally anticipated-
I'll be posting some pictures that I'll take today when my son is napping. my leaf springs, exterior and interior pics, trailer tongue, and some of the really scary stuff like wood rot on the back passenger side corner.
anyone have any suggestions for tires- I know we want ST tires-but I'd like your opinions rather than the tire shop guy's since you all have specific experience with these trailers. What do you have on you trailers and did you order them from a shop or online? how can I guarantee I'm getting the freshest manufactured tire?
also we looked at the door lock replacement cylinder available on vintage trailer supply-looks like everyone thinks they're awful-people have to order 2 or 3 because they fall apart... is there a better option?
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Post by bigbill on May 27, 2014 8:29:47 GMT -8
I suggest getting your locks to work but don't spend a fortune locking your doors because with a battery powered screw driver I can gain access to any of them in less than three minutes. Locks are to discourage kids and honest people.
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John Palmer
Senior Member
Hi, From a vintage trailer guy located in Santa Ana, CA. It's good to see lots of activity here.
Posts: 1,613
Likes: 569
Currently Offline
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Post by John Palmer on May 27, 2014 9:50:31 GMT -8
Thanks for asking "well thought out" questions. Your going to be fine, and have a great time with your new trailer. It is important to have a "big picture" view when getting into a new area, but do not get overwhelmed with all of our details.
I think that millions of "short tongue" trailers have been built and towed with out any problems. But what has happened is that the modern vehicles that we use to tow today have changed. For example on my F150 Crew Cab they used a short 5 1/2 foot long bed. To gain back the storage space they made the bed very high, and the design actually works very well. It also has the bumper and hitch tucked tightly against the body. On a common 1956 truck, the bed would have been lower, narrower, and the hitch set back further. But when you add a sixty year old short tongue trailer, then combine the short tongue with a "canned ham" shape, and then have a "high bed" truck your setting yourself up for an interference problem that will only occur during backing because you can turn "sharper in reverse, than pulling forward". In my driveway case, I have a slight dip at my curb for drainage, and with the trailer cut over "during the back in", it was "uncomfortably close".
BigBill brings up a very good point that I did not address. The extra length "is an asset" for clearance, but "the extra leverage" is not a good thing if your marginal on your hitch and tongue weights. This was the reason that I shortened (by re-drilling the pin hole) the Hidden Hitch #80232 extension by 3" to 13", in my original reply. I simply needed the extra 12" to 13", but the 16" "looked to long" for me. I also suggested this specific extension because it replaces the short coupler, it is NOT one of the many "male to female" extenders on the market. IMO, you want the fewest number of joints in the connection. I hate hearing the "Klunk-Klunk" each time you start and stop. For this reason I also use a (locking) Drawtite hitch bolt that has a nut that you tighten to eliminate the coupler looseness.
Brakes, do you already have them? Are they just not hooked up? Have you looked at the axle, some axles have the bolt flange already welded on to add brake backing plates. If you done car brakes, trailers are easy. Just make sure you get the Right side on the Right side, and the Left side on the Left side. It's only going to work correctly is they turn in the correct direction.
Tires, I let someone else open that can of worms. The most important thing is proper WEIGHT RATING matched to your trailer, and correct AIR PRESSURE. UV sun rays kill trailer tires, they do not wear out, they ROT out. They should be replaced on a three to four year schedule.
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SusieQ
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'62 Shasta Compact
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Post by SusieQ on May 27, 2014 10:45:29 GMT -8
I frequently tow with a hitch extension. I have a dual hitch extender which gives me another receiver for my bike rack. It does make a little difference in backing but it didn't seem like enough to matter to me. Sometimes I just have to pull forward, straighten up and start over. And it it makes a significant difference in tongue weight (have to include my bikes there, too).
I also use hitch tighteners, or quieters, not sure what they are called, but they take up any slack and keep the extension bar from rattling in the receiver.
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Post by bigbill on May 27, 2014 11:20:24 GMT -8
A lot of people do a lot of things and live to tell about it, but some don't. All I am saying just because you see someone else doing something before you try it make sure the setup you have will do it safely. Two vehicles that look exactly the same can be rated totally different as SusieQ and others can tell you when they bought their vehicle they bought it setup to tow, but you might have one that looks the same but doesn't have the same things installed to pull a trailer. All I am preaching is BE CAREFUL and Be sure you are right then go ahead. Your family's well being depends on it. I may seem over cautious but after you pull A few bodies out of a pile of twisted steel you get that way. Sorry if this message is a downer.
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diymom
Active Member
enthralled with my 1969 Terry, problem is it keeps me awake at night planning
Posts: 323
Likes: 51
1969 terry 18'
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Post by diymom on May 27, 2014 12:09:08 GMT -8
ok---now that I took a bunch of pictures underneath I feel like even more of a sucker...man- this thing is far from clean-cut conduit ends, wires hanging, rat holes, what looks like some sort of leak-though there is no water tank. most of the wood looks sound but there is plenty of what I hope is only surface rust. you can see the brakes in one image sorta- I'm 6 months pregnant, my son wasn't cooperating and there are now a few giant piles of dirt next to the trailer thanks to the yard work we did yesterday-so taking good pictures underneath was a little tough. Good point about the lock-really-a committed crook could easily gain entry into one of these things-like most older cars-my 59 chevy can be opened with a coat hanger and started with a screwdriver. is there any way to keep these trailers a little more theft proof that won't involve having a huge bolt on the outside? here are the pictures. the thing I think I am most happy about on the trailer-the curly cues. front lh side of trailer chassis and wiring. I thought everyone had axle springs and a more substantial axle-this looks too simple. rat hole? its under the dinette seat on lh. leak? i wasn't wet...maybe oil? my rear rh cargo door lower rear sill area-whats left at least
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Post by kto17 on May 27, 2014 12:25:54 GMT -8
That first pic is a trailer saver. Somewhere on the board I posted a really funny ad for them I found.
That axle is an original. I read an ad somewhere that they were rated for 4,000 pounds.
What looks like a rat hole under the dinette could be a drain hole for the original water tank. Mine has a stub of pipe that hangs down for draining the tank.
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Post by bigbill on May 27, 2014 12:59:02 GMT -8
This looks pretty much like any other trailer of its age that hasn't been redone. As far as the door locks the easy way in would be to unscrew a window.
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diymom
Active Member
enthralled with my 1969 Terry, problem is it keeps me awake at night planning
Posts: 323
Likes: 51
1969 terry 18'
Currently Offline
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Post by diymom on May 27, 2014 13:06:37 GMT -8
those "trail savers" are just an option that is mounted under the spring, right? I can see them interfering with trailer mobility, but otherwise I like them-looked for the post, want to see the ad!
(I'm sickly really into ephemera-not just ads...i have all sorts of bizarre stuff that makes me perk up and smile...I find some of the things that were printed to be very similar to japanese or chinese material printed in english today for their own markets-really hokey, takes a minute to understand or try to figure out, strange picture correlations...odd wording...not at all Politically correct-outright bizarre and awkward...those are the best)
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